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December 06, 2004



Your program sounds excellent, and I wish you the best of luck in getting it started. Hopefully the Schwyzer Sexual Harassment Seminar will spread across the country!

Lawrence Krubner

If you'd like to go into more detail here, in public, please do. On the one hand, a workshop that goes over stuff like compliments and appropriateness sounds interesting. On the other hand, I'm wondering if there is enough of a concensus (away from what the law says) about what is appropriate for there to be much to teach other than "Be careful. Be very, very careful. Don't touch, don't compliment, don't act casual, don't ask her to join you for a cup of coffee at the diner, don't do anything. Be careful."


i'd like to see you write out the Schwyzer S.H.S How To, er, uh, no that's not it, preventing it...

but really, this is valuable... please do write and share... or maybe we'll finally meet in person and talk about this and other topics???


Yes, Rudy, we'll get together. January will see me with lots of free time. And I am going to work on some serious proposals -- hold me to it.


[i]don't ask her to join you for a cup of coffee at the diner[/i]

This isn't so much as being careful as recognizing a social norm. "Want you and me to go out for coffee?" is generally recognized as "Would you like to go on a date?"


Yeah, somehow, "Let's go grab lunch" is different than "Let's go get coffee."


Well, Rudy is a man... I suspect Kafi can handle it if I ask him out to lunch.

La Lubu

Must be a California thing....here in Illinois, coffee is coffee. Dinner is date.

Jonathan Dresner

In a lot of places "coffee" is a mini-date, because it can also be a non-date.....

La Lubu

Hmm...do you think that's related to the cultural level of alcohol intake? Here, drinks (meaning alcohol) after work would be the mini-date; coffee is what you go for when you want there to be no misunderstanding that it's a "just friends" outing.

I don't mean that to sound like we're all a bunch of lushes out here in the boonies (lol!), but that maybe there are fewer drinkers in Cali, so coffee is more serious!


I think it's because dinner is a heavy-date thing, and lunch can be businessy. Breakfast can have different connotations, depending on where you spent the night before. Brunch is relaxed. Drinks is clearly a date. But coffee is a scoping-you-out kind of thing that's lower-pressure than either drinks or dinner.

In fact, there's a cafe here in New York called Drip that's got it's own dating service. You either look through entries at the cafe or you make your first contacts online and meet up at Drip or one of their affiliated cafes.


Crap. I mean't "its" own dating service.

Greg Robie

I stumbled onto your blog when doing some reviewing of the controversy Millard and Habitat seem to be weathering. About 35 years ago I, and my 5 speed bicycle, hitched a ride with Millard and Linda in their station wagon from DC to Koinonia as part of a bicycle trip I was on at the time--but that is another story.

The comments that have been made so far in this thread are not, from my experience, very deep nor enlightening. If you are looking to take the sexual harassment discussion to a deeper and/or safer level--for men or women--I suggest reviewing the role stress plays in human sexuality in the context of the differences between the sexes relative our neuroendocrinology, how we process stress, and what constitutes the feeling of intimacy.

I recommend Candace Pert's book, _Molecules of Emotion_, the UCLA study "Biobehavioral Responses to Stress in Females: Tend-and-Befriend, Not Fight-or-Flight", Taylor, Klein, Lewis, Gruenewald, Gurung, and Updegraff (Psychological Review. Vol. 107 July 2000), and if you haven't seen it yet, the movie "What The Bleep Do We Know", as a baseline for engaging in new thinking relative to this subject.

Socially, we are in a place of transition where we cannot solve the problems we have created by using the same thinking we engaged in when creating them! To the degree that language is a shared representation of what is commonly understood, we are basically without a language in attempting this conversation. There are such discreet differences in thinking involved in our sexual/social interactions that virtually no meaningful language exists for a significant segment of humanity which can inclusively communicate across the differences. If one is to take the sexual harassment conversation to a safer level, the context of the conversation must change.

Such a change, unfortunately, is all about power. Since humans are reticent to give up power, this change is neither easy, nor safe . . . but it is needed.



I think that Habitat for Humanity is a great thing do you have any experience working for habitat for Humanity?

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Hello, how you're doing today!!!???
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Millard Fuller's resignation as president of Habitat for Humanity.

The allegations are depressingly familiar:

In a characteristic act of frugality, Habitat for Humanity founder Millard Fuller hitched a ride to the Atlanta airport with a female staff member to

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